hello from Colorado

[skwiggly]

Hey all,
Just discovered this forum. I'm usually over at legacygt.com, but now that I know about this, will definitely be checking in regularly.

I bought my silver '06 LGT Ltd last Nov. 2008, and love it. It's my daily driver, have a '91 300ZX Twin Turbo that comes out to play in the summer months. Since the Z puts down 300 whp, I decided the Subie needed to catch up a bit, so it'll be going to stage 2 soon

Here's a pic of the LGT from this month, up at Lost Lake:


catch you later,
skwiggly

[havanisda]

Nice drop. What suspension u runnin? Mod list?

[skwiggly]

Cobb springs, which *supposedly* drop about 1.75" F, 1" R. I don't think it dropped that much in the front, but ended up with pretty ideal fender gap all around IMO.

Mods:
- Megan Racing single-tip cat-back exhaust
- Perrin short ram intake
- Cobb springs
- DBA Street slotted rotors
- Hawk HPS brake pads
- TechnaFit stainless steel brake lines
- ATE Super Blue brake fluid
- MB Motorsports Boost 17x7 wheels
- Kartboy short shifter
- JazzyFM aux-in

To be installed:
- Autospeed catted downpipe
- Greddy catless uppipe

And then I'm getting Super Rupair up in Boulder to do an open-source dyno tune

[havanisda]

U been runnin an untuned Perrin short ram?

[skwiggly]

No, its actually not currently on the car. It will go back on when I get the up/downpipe installed and get it tuned. I actually only had it on for about a week and took it off since I didn't have any other supporting mods, and wasn't too into the "whoosh"...and if it doesn't really add anything on the dyno, I'll probably ditch it for good.

[havanisda]

https://www.legacygt.org/forums/showt...t=perrin+short

[skwiggly]

Very good reading, thanks! I had read some stuff that indicated the stock setup was able to support stage 2 no problem, but never that the Perrin was such a problem. Good to know. I have an AVO panel filter right now, so it might just stay in there....

[havanisda]

[TSi+WRX]

Tim Bailey spent quite a lot of time with my car on the dyno, to work out the dynamics of the Perrin Short Ram. Both he and the driver had huge headaches, by the time they climbed out of my car, at the end of that extended dyno stint. Let's just say I lucked out that so many people decided to not show for their tune-date reservations that day. Tim didn't even charge me extra for the extended dyno session.

-----

I got that intake early on. It was one of the first ones available for the LGT, and since I came on-scene decently early, well, my choices were limited. I then paid quite a bit of dough to keep that intake-tract noise that I was - and remain - addicted to.

I honestly don't know if their revised design have made things better. I haven't read/heard much about it in the BL/BP world.

I'd say ditch it, and get yourself one of the better intakes, such as the K&N Typhoon, if you're addicted to the noise - or else to just go to the factory airbox, outright, and wait until you need intake-tract revisions (i.e. FMIC, etc.) before you spend any more on this area.

[skwiggly]

Ok, Tsi+WRX, your experience has pretty much settled it for me. I might ask my tuner (Super Rupair in Boulder) if they've ever tuned for a Perrin ram, just out of curiosity, but it definitely is NOT worth a bunch of extra dyno time, especially if it's for a minimal or possibly non-existent HP gain. Are you still running yours?

[john]

Welcome aboard from an '05 owner in Castle Rock.

[TSi+WRX]

Originally Posted by skwiggly

Ok, Tsi+WRX, your experience has pretty much settled it for me. I might ask my tuner (Super Rupair in Boulder) if they've ever tuned for a Perrin ram, just out of curiosity, but it definitely is NOT worth a bunch of extra dyno time, especially if it's for a minimal or possibly non-existent HP gain.

In so far as I understand, there wasn't anything "left on the dyno," in terms of the Legacy's application. The same goes for the SPT Short-Ram, again, if the tuner is willing to sit there for hours on end, to "get it right."

It's really the unpredictability of these intakes, in so far as the specific/unique-vehicle-to-vehicle differences, that's the cause for concern, and why tuners end up spending so much time to tune *each* car for these intakes.

Something more MAF-stable, like the K&N Typhoon Short-Ram (there are also several others on-market now, but I've honestly been out of this side of the market for so long that I've lost track ), would be a much better choice, if the induction-noise is something you really want to go after.

Tim's from PDXTuning, which is intimate with Perrin. Yet, he still steps out of the car and shakes his head and mouths the word "intake." You get the idea.

One caveat to this is that Perrin recently changed their SRI design for the Legacy. I honestly do not know if this new configuration fares any better.

Similarly, Perrin, over the last year and a half or so, introduced an "extension" to the SRI piping to make it a true "cold-air" intake, into the fenderwell. I don't know if the extra piping distance may give the airflow a chance to smooth out and become more consistent, before reaching the MAF.

Are you still running yours?

Yes, I'm simply addicted to the way it sounds.

I've had this car tuned twice, and both times, it was with this intake in place, and both times, it caused the respective tuner a bit of additional time.

Tim Bailey was definitely the more diligent of the two, and really went after the MAF.

The other problem with the Perrin is that it lacks a heat-shield. If you monitor IAT, it'll shoot up whenever the car's stopped. And even though a TMIC sprayer can help the temps come down pretty fast, it's still not great. Given how sensitive our cars are to IAT (and the fact that it is the only intake tract temperature sensor, unfortunately), and use it to calculate timing factors, well...it's really another reason why the factory airbox is so good for stock-turbo vehicles.

[skwiggly]

Thanks very much for the info! After reading your post in the thread havanisda referenced above, it seems the Perrin is just not worth the bother. I don't really care about the intake sound enough to bother, that's for sure. I get more of a kick out of uncorking the exhaust sound of the boxer

Also, according to this article by Cobb (http://www.cobbtuning.com/info/?ID=3223)
"From our testing, we've found the stock air box to work well even at 350-375 HP"
So it really seems an aftermarket intake is only called for when you're way past stage 2...I'm planning on enjoying stage 2 for a while, so works for me!

[kagenmateer]

Welcome!

[drod1985]

Have any of you CO guys visited the Suba Performance shop in Denver? I don't think they tune, but the guy over there mentioned a place in boulder who does...maybe Super Rupair or whatever?

thanks,

[skwiggly]

I've had the following done at Suba:
- 30k mile service
- lowering springs
- up & downpipe

And have been very happy with their service, prices, and willingness to advise me frankly on various issues. And willing to deal with the various parts I've bought online and brought in Definitely recommend them.

Correct, they do not do dyno tuning; they sent me to Harvey up at Super Rupair in Boulder, who did my stage 2 tune that I'm VERY happy with. Harvey is the MAN.

Scott

[drod1985]

Good deal. I'm glad to know someone has gone in there bc I never see anyone outside the joint. It looks pretty sketchy, but they seemed knowledgeable at least. I spoke w/ Kyle, and he said that he can get pretty good deals on most parts. Did he order anything for your ride? Priced any lower than what you were able to find online? I'm looking to throw in UP/DP/Sways/Springs soon plus regular mileage doctor's visits. I appreciate the advice, homie!

[skwiggly]

Yea, it seems a sketchy neighborhood, but it's just an industrial wasteland up there

Kyle can definitely get good deals for sure. I just like to buy used parts if possible, and shop pretty hard online for the best deals. So far they've only done labor for me. I tried doing the springs myself and couldn't get some of the bigger strut bolts broken free, then it also turned out I needed a new top hat on one corner. If you have the proper tools (long breaker bar, or ideally air tools) you can do them yourself.

For the up/downpipe install, reading people's experiences online (ie "it took me 6 hours to install my uppipe, and then it leaked so I had to do it all over again!" ), it seemed more trouble than I was willing to put into it, so I had them handle that one too.

Sways seem pretty easy, you could proabably do those yourself.

[drod1985]

It's crazy how much difference a half-mile makes bc I live up that way too. Industrial to yuppyville in a few blocks...

I have a buddy who rents a garage w/ lifts and all the tools, so I think we will be installing the sways, springs, and strut braces ourselves. As far as the UP/DP (and someday the new TMIC), I will definitely be taking it into the guys @ Suba for some assistance.

Thanks again.